Posted on Monday, 20th August 2012 by Nathon Woodhead
"Have a bit of that you scouse c*nt!"
Securing the signature of Robin Van Persie proves a number of things to the footballing world:
Firstly, it sends a message to the rest of the country that there is still sense in football.
Money isn’t the be all and end all to every player – and this world class forward, in his own words, made his choice because “Manchester United breathes football”.
Yes, I accept he may be on a good wage at Old Trafford, but ask any Arsenal fan and they will tell you, he was on a good screw at the Emirates. Ask any gloating City fan and they will happily tell you in no uncertain terms, whatever United could offer in wages, City could, and would, easily double it. Sense and passion over finance with Mr Van Persie.
Secondly, this transfer, I believe, will force the end of a Premier League giant. Arsenal have been a major threat to United since the Premier League began in 92. A club with rich history, tradition and a solid foundation bringing players through from youth level, season after season. However, over the past eight years, too many superstars have walked through the exit door.
Every great team goes through a transition period, every great team loses a superstar – but this Arsenal side have lost their very best player, to a United side which was already head and shoulders above them in terms of quality. Unfortunately for Arsenal, a club I respect, I believe this is the end. I only hope for their sake they do not become the new Liverpool.
Finally, the importance of this transfer is, fundamentally, the player. Robin Van Persie is a world class striker. A game changer. A leader. A winner. Granted, there is the niggle of injury problems, but what more can a man do than keep himself fit for a whole season to prove his worth?
Moving away from Van Persie, and on to the section of United fans who were unhappy with this deal – the fundamental problem is apparent: “We do not need a striker, we need a central midfielder.”
Why hasn’t Sir Alex invested in a world class central midfielder?
The simple answer is, there isn’t a world class central midfielder out there who is available.
Many of you will challenge this answer by rolling off the names of 10-15 central midfielders playing in the Premier League, in Europe, and around the world. But, thinking seriously and logically for a moment, ask yourself, would they actually improve our squad?
Obviously there are players like Ozil, Schweinsteiger, Xavi, Iniesta and Yaya Toure who are all outstanding footballers – but not one of them would join our club. There is more chance of Gary Neville coming out of retirement to play for Liverpool, than any of these players leaving their clubs. So on to a more realistic list of targets.
This week we have seen a talented young Englishman in Jack Rodwell join the noisy neighbours. Have we missed out? I do not think so. £15m for a player who couldn’t force his way into the Everton side most weeks.
The Newcastle pair of Cabaye and Tiote. Industrious, strong, creative. Would you pick either player ahead of Cleverley or Anderson? If this is even a debate, then the answer to signing them is a firm no. I do not want big bucks spent on a player who ‘might’ get in the side. It is either a signing in which they are the first name on the team sheet, or it is a young player who we can develop.
Luka Modric – an exceptional talent who rarely loses the ball – but £35m? Is he that much better at keeping the ball than Carrick or Scholes? He certainly doesn’t possess the hard work of a fit Darren Fletcher. Where exactly would Modric fit in and who would lose their place to him?
More names in the mix are Sahin, M’Vila, Moutinho and Lucas Moura. We have all played Football Manager, we have all won the league with Huddersfield. It isn’t real. Just because a player turns out great in the game, and had a good season last year in France or Portugal, doesn’t mean it will work in real life.
We have seen some very poor central players try and fail over the years at Old Trafford. Liam Miller, Kleberson, Djemba Djemba, Darron Gibson – need I go on?
I do not for one moment argue that, sooner or later, Scholes and Giggs will need replacing. I fully understand Fletcher may not return as the tenacious player he once was.
I accept Kagawa and Powell may take time to get used to the rigours of the Premier League.
What I cannot and will not accept is that the Robin Van Persie transfer money should have been spent on a ‘world class’ central midfielder.
The vision of Scholes, the skill of Ronaldo, the leadership qualities of Roy Keane, the fight of Bryan Robson… this player simply does not exist.
All comments welcome.
To respond to this story, or any of my news updates, I am on Twitter: @NathonW
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Tags: Kagawa, Van Persie
Posted in Blogs, We'll never die | Comments (79)
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August 20th, 2012 at 2:23 am
i accept that a quality playmaker better than what we have isnt available and if he is might not be ready for the setup (like Eriksen) but we need a defensive/ball winning type and price/availability might be an issue but De Rossi/Javi Martinez would make us better and are worth the fees involved.
tbh i would have no problem with us taking a gamble on a cheap prospect but i think players from the past have scared us off this route.
oh and M’Vila is also the real deal but i accept that he might fail but he is a talented player.
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Dibils Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 4:08 am
Martinez is going for 40m Euros.. sorry but no way is he worth that.
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Jack Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 10:54 am
imo yes he is, his only 23 very talented and although most of the time its not needed he can cover CB (which would be handy at the moment) for me his the missing link and i believe he could be a key player for 10 years(give or take a couple,) so would off value
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August 20th, 2012 at 2:35 am
thank you! i wish every UTD fan would see this. i totally agree and have been preaching this. lets also not forget Cleverley is hugely promising and if anderson can stay fit he can be quality. i had seen people say we should sign Barton
that he would improve us… no he really wouldnt. Parker was talked about too and again he is good but not someone thats world class.
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:01 am
I believe at one point, there was a gap which could have been filled by Parker. However, the emergence of Cleverley and the fact Jones can also play that role does prove Parker would have been a waste of £13m
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August 20th, 2012 at 2:51 am
The evidence of the last few years speaks for itself – simply, that United are utterly bereft of the kind of creative verve and spark to seriously challenge the best teams in Europe and England where the midfield is concerned. All they can rely on is to take advantage of pitch width wherever possible to ply the usual one-dimensional wing play that has made them so predictable in lieu of any drive or real danger through the middle of the pitch. Did you not notice how Valencia’s effectiveness fell away markedly towards the end of last season as teams realized how much of United’s play was being orchestrated down the right sideline? Valencia became a closely marked man, and by shutting him down United basically ran out of ideas.
Is there anyone better than Carrick and Scholes – are you joking? The former is a flat track bully who has only put one good game together against quality European opposition, while for the rest of the time he’s looked pedestrian and overwhelmed. Scholes today is not the man he was 5 – 6 years ago, and only thrives when lesser teams allow him oodles of space and don’t challenge him. Pressed for time and space he is proving far more fallible than in his younger years. And as for Fletcher, even without the illness he is merely a workhorse, a terrier harrying the opposition’s midfielders. Being a first class pest on the pitch doesn’t make a world class midfielder, especially for a player low on skill, passing ability, and shot accuracy.
So in short, yes, just about anyone else would bolster the engine room because whether it’s Van Persie you want to sing praises about, or Pele, or Zico, or Maradona, NONE OF THEM would thrive at United without first class delivery from the midfield, especially from an engine room that doesn’t know the first thing about possession football and frequently concedes an enormous amount of time on the ball to the opposition – particularly when they trundle out Giggs in the middle, who’d be neck and neck with Rooney for being the greatest wastrels of possession in the team.
Far be it for someone like me to question someone so obviously well connected with management at Europe’s major clubs, but a number of the midfielders you mentioned would most certainly have been available for the kind of money that United have spent so far during the off season.
And for all the hoopla about suddenly having a ‘big four’ strike force again reminiscent of the 99 team, United already has a decent quartet of strikers. How insulting to Berbatov is all this commentary, when the guy was the club’s top scorer two years ago, and would have won the golden boot by a country mile had Fergie not suddenly taken a dislike to the Bulgarian’s superlative gifts. He also easily bested Rooney last season when it came to goals per minutes played, even more notable when one takes out all of Rooney’s goals from dead ball situations. A strike force of Rooney, Wellbeck, Chicharito and Berbatov is one that most clubs would salivate over, so don’t try and sell us on the notion that Van Persie is suddenly the second coming of Christ where United is concerned – especially as virtually no one has ever worked well in tandem with Rooney. Added to all this is the insult to Wellbeck, who was essentially anointed as the next big thing last season and has suddenly been dumped to second string while Fergie throws out everything he’s said in the past about signing aging players for large sums in order to try and bolster a legacy that is quickly drawing to a close.
Make no mistake, the signing of Van Persie was nothing more than a knee-jerk reaction by an elderly statesman of the game who has suddenly realized that time is quickly catching up with him, especially given the realization that the late season debacle he presided over a few months ago may have been his last decent shot at the coveted 20th title he wanted to sign off with.
In so many ways, with the double standards and kid glove treatment involving Rooney, and in the way he’s thrown out the future in pursuit of short term personal glory, Fergie is beginning to mirror Sir Matt Busby’s last years at the helm. Let’s just hope the present team doesn’t suffer the same catastrophic price Busby’s team suffered when his short-sighted actions ended up gutting the team to a point where it sank to the old second division soon after his departure. Make no mistake, unless some Arab or Russian sugar daddy comes along United will feel the financial pinch from the Van Persie signing in the next few years because the outlay represented a very poor investment for the future.
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:08 am
Not every signing has to be a major investment for the future with a sell on fee. If a player is good enough, he shouldn’t even be re-sold. No manager should buy a player with a future sale in mind.
Surely the amount we do invest into young players gives us the right to go out and purchase one established superstar? Its not like we throw money around like City or Chelsea. This has been proven by pulling out of the Hazard and Moura deals. Too much money for unproven players.
To call the Van Persie signing a knee jerk reaction is laughable. Knee jerk was Bebe – ‘raw’ talent that nobody had seen. Van Persie was the best player in the Premier League last season. Nothing knee jerk about that.
If he had gone to City, I imagine 99% of the fan base would be moaning that we did not open our wallet. It seems a no win situation with a lot of you.
If we spend, we apparently spend stupidly, if we don’t spend, we will be left behind.
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PJ Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 4:27 pm
Agree with most most of your views esp regarding Berbatov. He is a brilliant player but he also likes to score in bursts and is kind of a flat track bully himself. If given a chance he could work well with welbeck.
Coming to our midfield problem- hell i’m sincerely pissed of with us trying to copy barca with their tiki-taka crap. we just pass sideways and stand still, there’s no forward movement from midfield. we pass sideways-back-side again until we get bored then scholes pings one out to the wing to nani/valencia who then either give the ball away or cross str8 to the opponents head.
Then the major problem in the team and that is our “Best Player” Rooney. god u must be kidding me if u seriously think he is our best player. He just scores goals and that too most of them penalties or tap ins. he loses possession so easily, has a poor touch, poor short passing game and just cannot play with another striker. Plus him and Nani dont really see eye to eye. he gets fed up way to easy with him.
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matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 5:06 pm
please, don’t give us the same old shit about carrick being pedestrian. you may have an issue with the role he plays in the team, and thats probably cause your a dickhead, but to say that carrick as a player is “overwhelmed” is quite astonishing.
what do you want him to do, ping 50 yard balls out of play like gerrard? want him to push higher up the field and leave our centre backs exposed? or would you like him to take players out like keane?
i just realised you complain about carrick and scholes and then wrote this :
“especially from an engine room that doesn’t know the first thing about possession football”.
good lord your a wank
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Thezonly1United Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 5:24 pm
I personally agree with quite a lot of your article especially when Nathon states that Tiote or Cabaye wouldn’t get in our side, I’m sorry but i beg ta differ, Anderson has threatened to be a top player on no more than 5 occasions, Carrick looks class then next minute a sh*th*use, Scholes possibly the greatest ever but unfortunately coming to the end, Giggs is past it for me, loses possession too easily with flicks here and flicks there and young Tom Cleverley has got it all ta do but i really, really hope he does it
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August 20th, 2012 at 2:53 am
Its a difficult argument if I’m being honest. I don’t subscribe to the theory of only wanting world class names. Its stupid to believe the fans wanted a big name and that’s it. Its correct in that we can all offer names, but I think they are names that can be better than what we have.
In my opinion I would pick Cabaye or Tiote above Anderson I am given the choice. I like Tom Cleverley and believe potentially he can be a top player. It is a massive season for him at 23 but I feel he is hungry and will work hard.
I believe Carrick, Cleverley, Scholes and Giggs are quality and they can help us win. However I don’t believe we can go into next season relying on Fletcher like we did for so long on Hargreaves. I also don’t have much confidence in Anderson any more. I would have preferred him to have been sold and a new player arrive. I do feel Cheick Tiote or Moussa Dembele would be better options for our midfield.
Dembele name being mentioned might surprise some people. However his stats are up there with the the top midfielder’s. He was the second most successful tackler in the league. He has great passing and dribbling stats as well. He would do well in a better team and playing alongside Carrick or Cleverley.
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August 20th, 2012 at 2:57 am
Carrick, Anderson and Fletcher are good players in the Premier League against the majority of teams. However come up against Europe’s top teams or even the likes of Benfica and Basel as was the case last season and they are exposed and fail to provide enough protection to the back four. Every other top team now plays with a Makelele-esk holding midfielder- alonso, song/busquets, toure etc. Tiote would be my first choice signing for that position and would easily start before Anderson and certainly Carrick. Anderson is injury prone and yet to prove himself and Carrick is over rated; not good enough going forward to be Scholes’ replacement (which kagawa may potentially be) and not good enough defensively to play in the CDM role. Ive watched Tiote for the last two seasons and he is as comfortable on the ball as our alternatives and ten times the player breaking up the oppositions’ play. He is the missing piece in us challenging on all fronts this season in my opinion. Not suggesting Van Persie wont be amazing for us but I think we have better alternatives up front than in central defensive midfield and that would have been my first priority
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:17 am
The point I am making is how much better is T
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:19 am
The point I am making is how much better is Tiote than Anderson? Is he worth £20m or would that be money spent on another player who is merely in the mix for a place.
If we are going to invest big, it needs to be for a player who will without question, be first name on the team sheet.
Spending £20-£30m on a player who is slightly better than what we have simply doesn’t work for me.
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Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 3:36 pm
Tiote isn’t slightly better, he may only be slightly better on the ball than Anderson but in terms of tackling, breaking up play, and protecting the back four Tiote is far superior and would be the first name on the team sheet for me seeing as we don’t have another quality defensive midfielder. Yes 20 million is a bit steep and I felt he did enough in his first premier league season to justify us going for him then for under 10 mil. However we didn’t and if filling the holding midfield void does prove to be the missing piece in a challenge on all fronts then 20 million would be worth every penny.
M’Villa or Wanyama of Celtic are two other options for that position and would be cheaper than Tiote. I haven’t seen as much of them in action but from the little I have both look to be good options. My point is not that we must buy Tiote in particular he is just the best I have seen but we undoubtedly need a good holding midfielder to protect the back four and allow the flair players more freedom (which will be particularly important if we are playing rvp and rooney up front and kagawa is pushed back into central midfield).
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sean Reply:
August 26th, 2012 at 9:58 am
This guy knows his stuff
August 20th, 2012 at 3:00 am
Also yes Cleverly could be great and another potential Scholes replacement but not the Defensive mid me need.
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August 20th, 2012 at 3:02 am
Totally agree with you mate. In addition to ando n clev, we also have tunniclife, lingaard n petrucci coming through and they all need to be given 1st team opportunities SOON (otherwise will leave like pogba). Having said that, nevertheless, de rossi would be a perfect signing for MU, especially if we want to play 4-2-3-1 formation (de rossi n carrick play as the 2 deep lying midfielders). Another “overaged” player who will have no sell on value, but I believe he’d be worth it. But, then again, would roma let him go? Not sure abt that
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August 20th, 2012 at 4:13 am
While I do not dispute about the points as mentioned in the article, I do have the following concerns over our midfiled:
1. Anderson has been given a few years to prove he is the right midfielder that Man U wants, but it is still unsure whether this is the case.
2. Carrick is aging and there has been just too many occasions that he has lost pocession in dangerous area leading to goals against us.
3. Powell has yet to prove himself in the Premier League
4. Fletcher – is he fully recovered?
so, what have we got left? Kagawa just joined and it will take time for him to adjust to the EPL.
At the moment, I agree that those midfielders that Man U needs are not in the market right now, however, it is also true that our mid-field needs strengthening…..
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August 20th, 2012 at 4:32 am
Meh. If I could have signed one player this off-season, it would have been Javi Martinez. I think Kagawa and Powell are excellent players, but I would have rather seen the money spent on van Persie go towards the player who is probably the closest thing to Sergio Busquets outside of Sergio Busquets, which is something we desperately need. Honestly, a midfielder in that mold might create a better offense than signing van Persie, strange as that might sound. But a Martinez or M’Vila type would allow Kagawa, Cleverley, Rooney, to worry less about keeping possession and allow them to take more risks.
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August 20th, 2012 at 5:28 am
The only player I would have tried for is Martinez. He is a similar player to Carrick but I think he has a better eye for a ‘killer’ pass than Carrick. Also he could be cover for CB and again I think he is technically better than Jones, Smalling and Evans.
This is a player I would have got in along with RVP not instead of.
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August 20th, 2012 at 5:32 am
This “ball winning midfielder” we all love so much may well become a thing of the past. Watcing Barca, Spain, Italy, none of these teams play with a ball winning midfielder. Football is a becoming a passing game & i think Sir Alex knows it. We have been getting passed to death by inferior opponents all last Season.
I heard countless pundits say England need to start training kids at Grassroots level to love the ball so we can compete. Maybe having Carrick, Kagawa & Cleverly in the mid will help move us along.
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Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 4:37 pm
They all play with a holding midfielder. Busquets, Busquets, De Rossi in the cases of your examples. Granted they are comfortable on the ball as all players need to be at the top level but they’re purpose is to protect the defence and allow the more creative players to flourish.
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sean Reply:
August 26th, 2012 at 10:01 am
United is missing that man, Carrick does it but not on a world class level
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August 20th, 2012 at 6:10 am
Makes sense. Am tired of fans disrespecting the manager. It is not ps3 after all and fergie knows best and in him we must trust. Look at arsenal no trophy for years yet they back wenger and we fume and fret all the times the greed accusation on fergie for supporting the IPO was the most shocking and sad episode. Comming to central midfield a friend in spain a real fan says kaka is indeed manu bound.
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August 20th, 2012 at 6:12 am
Well you have said it. if i were asked i wouldnt prefer a defensive midfielders because the first tactic of defending is out playing or out possessing your opponent completely and you dont get that from defensive midfielders but creative and attacking midfielders.and we might even be surprised when the new players settle and the team becomes a had rock to crack
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August 20th, 2012 at 6:50 am
Wht a stupid article???
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August 20th, 2012 at 7:36 am
Defence. Defence. Defence. Defence. Utd lost titie because of Evans, Evra, Rafael, Ferdinand. Period. Buttner should not be Evra’s cover but the other way around. Utd should have bought Hummels, Piszcek, Subotic.
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:25 am
Our defensive record was not that poor but I fully appreciate the gaps.
Do you not see Smalling (when fit) as a future centre half for us?
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August 20th, 2012 at 7:54 am
i personally feel instead of spending the 20 million on buying some player from outside….i would rather spend that money on developing and giving a chance to the young players we have in the form of petrucci, lindgard, and others….
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August 20th, 2012 at 8:14 am
I think we should develop the youngsters we have…See Fletch had a good 90 minutes with the under 21s hopefully wont be long before he is pushing for a first team place
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August 20th, 2012 at 8:28 am
We could get Tiote if we coughed up enough money. I wish we would. He is a better ball-winning midfielder than anyone currently at the club. Cabaye would improve the squad too. Selling Anderson would release a tidy sum to set against either purchase
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:46 am
I agree selling Anderson to fund Tiote would be a great piece of business. However, it just isn’t as easy as that is it.
Would anybody want Anderson for £10-£15m?
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sean Reply:
August 26th, 2012 at 10:05 am
U cannot sell Anderson to get Tiote or you’ll still be left with a hole, Tiote is the player to bench Carrick, you can sell ando for cabaye or dembele
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August 20th, 2012 at 9:10 am
yes sir explanation is better. now i can get ur alternative MAN UTD simply the best.
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August 20th, 2012 at 9:23 am
I cannot work out this Javi Martinez loving. He is behind Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets, Fabregas and Xabi Alonso in the Spanish pecking order, yet worth £40m?
I assume you had all heard of him before we played against him last season, or is this another case of ‘he was excellent against us, so must be world class’?
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Jack Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 11:00 am
in case you havent noticed la liga gets very good coverage over here and it was clear to see that before we played Bilbao that he was a class player.
Busquets is only ahead of him because his a fairly good player and has a connection to the Barca boys, while the others you mention at brilliant players that would get into any team.
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 11:22 am
Yes I fully appreciate La Liga gets al ot of coverage in the UK, but until last season, nobody had given this guy a look.
It was only the excellent European form of Athletic Bilbao that made people sit up and take more notice of their players.
Now people are saying they would be willing to pay £40m for Javi Martinez?
It is nonsense.
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August 20th, 2012 at 9:38 am
I donno why idiots keep writing blogs about central midfielders, do you know your team? do you know football ? We already have central midfielders in Tom Ando Giggs and Shinji who also apears to be able to play that role and Fletcher when he gets fit, then we have Scholes a deep lying creative mid and Carrick. What united lacked in the last few years was an attacking midfielder ( kagawa) and defensive midfielder (tiote or Martinez). Now we have the attacking midfielder what we need is someone who gonna sit back protect the defence while our creative and hard working central men enjoy going forward, and am not talking about Carrick am talking about world class, players who knows that role like the back of their hand
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 9:45 am
And who is this world class player you speak of?
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sean Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 12:42 pm
Errrrrrr Martinez M’villa Bousquet and Tiote, those are world class. Carrick plays that role but the only attribute he’s got is passing, to be world class in that role you should be able to pass with both feet like Carrick not necessarily 50 yards passes, but the most important attributes are defensive qualities such as positioning movement reading covering tackling wit a bit of aggression, Carrick is not agressive definatly posh and softy, he try to intercept instead of trying to close down an opponent and tackle ( see Everton’s 4th goal when we drew 4 4 last season, pieenar and Cahill or Osman made 3 or 4 quick passes around him on the edge of the box which lead to a goal, he should been pressing and closing down and hounding one of those guys instead of standing in between them as they pass it around him, he was a bypasser in that phase and two more before that, remember Barcelona 1st goal against us in Wembley? See him trying to intercept an iniesta pass to xavi instead of closing down he stood opened his long legs and thought let see if you can pass it through here). The third and most important thing about that role is being able to keep the ball under pressure, when people talk about makelele they talk about breaking play what they forget about is how good he was on the ball, I remember couple of season ago we played new castle at st. James park and lost, our biggest problem that night was Tiote, Rooney couldn’t handle him, he fooled him with twist and turns, slick controls, he evaded Rooney all the time which was the key to unbalancing our midfield. So a world class DM must be defensively sound must be able to pass and must be excellent under pressure. Carrick is not world class since he only got one of those qualities
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 1:42 pm
I can see your point and to an extent I do agree with you, but as I initially said in the article; those real world class players will not leave their clubs (Schweigsteiger, Yaya, Busquets) – and those who are available, are over priced.
Javi Martinez for £40m is a joke. If he was world class. he would be a Spain regular. I know they have alot of quality, but he is 6th choice.
M’Vila is unproven at the highest level yet going for £25m.
Tiote is an excellent ball winner, but does he have anything else to his game? Goals, definitely not. Creativity, I am not sure.
It seems we all want a mix of ball winner, passer, creative play maker. This player doesn’t exist.
Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 3:58 pm
Sean is 100% right. Holding midfielder is the key. Tiote doesnt need to attempt 50 yard balls, as long as he is good on the ball and plays the little passes that start off the moves he provides more defensive ability than the rest of the united midfield put together. Why would he need to be a creative world beater when his presence will release Kagawa, Nani/Young/Valencia and the front two to do what they do best.
The attacking force of valencia, evra, young, kagawa, nani, rooney and van persie would scare any defence, but crucially any counter attack made would have to get past vidic ferdinand and tiote to be successful.
August 20th, 2012 at 10:04 am
All of u have really given your views towards the central mid position nd I know am late though, buh I want to know wat happened to marek hamsik or isn’t he a good one?????
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 1:43 pm
As far as I am aware, he doesn’t want to leave Napoli.
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August 20th, 2012 at 10:04 am
I disagree with you. We lost Ronaldinho and later Yaya Toure to Barcelona because we felt they were not worth the prices placed on them. History has proved us wrong. There is someone out there who can do it well and better than Carrick. We must look for that one.
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 11:26 am
Yes I cannot argue that we have avoided taking a risk in the past, and as a result we have lost out on the players you mention.
However, putting the boot on the the other foot – we have taken risks with the likes of Kleberson and Veron. Neither of these players turned out great.
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August 20th, 2012 at 12:40 pm
“The Newcastle pair of Cabaye and Tiote. Industrious, strong, creative. Would you pick either player ahead of Cleverley or Anderson?”
Tiote? Definitely in my opinion. Miles ahead of Anderson and definitely ahead of Cleverly in the holding midfielder role. Don’t think there is any other player that matches Tiote in that role at the minute!
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 1:36 pm
Ok so would you spend £20-£25m on Tiote then?
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Clayton Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 2:54 pm
£15m or somewhere there for Tiote are appropriate in my opinion yes.
Feel free to criticize though. Not saying my opinion is the best one. But I honestly think so.
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Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 4:05 pm
I think it is the best one. Better than suggesting carrick or anderson and fletcher when fit are anywhere close to Tiote’s quality in the position which most fans seem to acknowledge that we need. Central Defensive Midfield. I think 18 million could tempt Newcastle and would be a good deal for all parties. Tiote is proven enough in the Premier League not to represent a huge risk, whilst being young enough (26) to get a good 5 years out of him and make the transfer fee worthwhile.
NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 6:33 pm
The risk is the fee. £18 for a player who might not even start.
For me, if we land a central midfielder, we need to ensure he is going to be the first name of the teamsheet everyweek.
I do admire your passion and enthusiasm for Tiote and will hold a bigger interest in him now as many of you seem convinced.
I am never too pig headed to admit I am wrong about a player. I will hold my hands up if he proves himself to be excellent.
Clayton Reply:
August 21st, 2012 at 7:56 am
Well rather than the £18 for Tiote I consider more risky the £24 for RVP.
This resilience about not signing a tenacious midfielder makes me think that Jones is being trained to eventually take that role which would be welcome.
Don’t think that Jones should be a future central defender unless he sorts out his heading. He’s a good player certainly but you can’t be a central defender if you can’t win first header on the ball.
Btw, Fellaini ran us ragged yesterday. Was wondering why Vidic was marking Jagielka instead of him in corners. Carrick was clearly struggling against his headers. However think that there were some positive outcomes from the team. Definitely think that Kagawa shall be one of our most important players this season.
August 20th, 2012 at 4:06 pm
See the name Tiote is popping up everywhere… He is the best DM in the league right now, behind Toure of course.
Why you keep insisting £20-£25 million price I don’t understand, but if we paid £25 for Ando yes I will pay that. But that is not his selling price, if Song went to Barca for 15-£19 million, No way your £20 will be valuated.
And yes He’s is better than both Cleverly and Ando.
You ask about his other attributes, He does score wonders occasionally, and assists, But he is a DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER, His role is to protect the Back four not goals!!!!! Look at Sagios goal record at Barca, is it impressive?!
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Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 4:31 pm
Anyone know a cute kid that we can send to old trafford tonight with a cardboard sign saying ‘Fergie please sign Tiote’?
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Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 4:42 pm
goodison park rather
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 6:36 pm
EZ, I take your point about the pricetag. I only say £20-£25m as it seems that is what we have been quoted; but you are spot on, if Alex Song has gone for £15m, maybe Tiote would be available for this fee?
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August 20th, 2012 at 5:06 pm
Everybody seems to have forgotten that United are, despite what a lot of our own fans seem to think, quite a good side.
Maybe a lot of people have fallen into the trap of thinking that United should win the league and European Cup every year. Well, it’s really not like that, is it?
Don’t lose sight of the fact that with our apparently shite team we actually came within 90 seconds of winning the league last year. We have no divine right to anything. Cleverley and Anderson spent large parts of last season unfit. Carrick deputised asa CB for Christ’s sake.
Will any United fan really suggest that a midfield of Nani, Anderson, Cleverley, Valencia, Young, Kagawa, Giggs, and Scholes with options to play Rooney in MF without affecting our potential to score goals is (a)not good enough to challenge at home and abroad and (b)not better than most other Premiership clubs? Just the six current internationals and the two exes?
Wake up people, stop complaining and support your team.
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August 20th, 2012 at 5:07 pm
and I forgot Carrick…
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Matt Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 5:25 pm
Forgetting Carrick is Easily done.
I agree that that midfield is good enough in the premier league and better than most teams in it. However i think in the later stages of the Champions League that same midfield will be shown as being not quite good enough to beat the barcelonas and real madrids of this world.
Even when everyone is fit I think we are missing a holding midfielder that has become the norm for the top teams in order to protect the defence and release attacking players.
Noone is suggesting a divine right to win things but fans are going to speculate on who could improve their team. That doesn’t mean those fans will support the team any less come September 1st if we haven’t brought in anyone else. All fans want their team to improve each year it is not a case of thinking we should win everything every year. However in our case improving the team would mean being able to challenge the best teams in the world as we have a great squad already.
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 6:40 pm
That ‘just support your team’ argument baffles me.
We all support the team.
Some go to games. Some watch from the sofa. Some stay up til 5am to watch a rubbish stream from a foreign land.
We are allowed opinions on who will and will not improve the team.
Personally, as I said within the article, I agree with you. Unless it is a real top class player, I do not see the point in bringing in somebody who is only as good as the players we have.
Massive Tiote fanbase on here. Many think he is the real deal.
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August 20th, 2012 at 6:04 pm
Agree. the defence is what united need to strengthen. i like the idea of carvalho, who is surplus at real madrid, on a short term loan of maybe 6 months, to provide cover at times of injury crisis, like the current situation.
I have also come across a website that gets all the highlights of all games in europe and south america, and are never removed. http://www.goalfeast.com – give it a try
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NathonW Reply:
August 20th, 2012 at 6:40 pm
Cheers mate
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August 20th, 2012 at 6:36 pm
Ferguson said he is interested in a player if he became available. I don’t believe he was talking about the Dutch left back who looks like signing. Buttner would have already been available and Man Utd made their interest known a month ago. Ferguson would have know Baines will cost around £15 million and it wasn’t worth spending that much on him. I think Baines is a top left back, but we needed someone to challenge Evra and give him move cover.
It’s possible that Ferguson was talking about a midfielder. We obviously will not know and I wouldn’t be surprised if Ferguson and Gill say the transfer window is finished once they complete the signing of a new left back. I would love another midfielder but it would need someone like Anderson to leave so that room can be created.
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August 20th, 2012 at 9:33 pm
fegie rules buys rvp off us for a 70 mill contract ,leaves manure with no center halfs and a dodgy midfield.laughing my head off watching fellani boss your weak midfield around.good job fergie you sure showed arsenal how to play lol.
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NathonW Reply:
August 21st, 2012 at 11:45 am
8 trophy-less seasons and a long list of captains walking out of your club. Mid table Arsenal.
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August 20th, 2012 at 9:52 pm
Anybody fancy chucking Fellaini in the mix?
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August 20th, 2012 at 11:36 pm
Fellaini really bossed us this evening, what a shame… Maybe I am having wrong ideas of “Get him“!!!
And Baines really showed why he’s better than Evra, gutted we didn’t get him.
Anyway Kagawa and Cleverly played there midgield part well.
(Still crying for Tiote, got a short fantasy for Fellaini).
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NathonW Reply:
August 21st, 2012 at 11:48 am
Fellaini was excellent. Baines did not impress me. He is too slow.
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August 20th, 2012 at 11:39 pm
I think fellaini would be perfect after seeing his performance against us 2nyt. I have been a fan of his for a couple of years so im not jst basin it on that but 2nyt killed any doubt tht he might not be able to step up to be man utd class. He single handedly bullied us tonight and hit the nail in the coffin. No one could touch him, his first touch was immense and he had just came back from an injury! Im not 100% but i believe he didnt play much if any of the pre-season either. If you want a player that can make an impact straight away i pick the man with the fro everytime! Also tiote would be second choice but i think out of the two fellaini would be the easier to get.
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August 21st, 2012 at 12:55 am
seriously carrick and scholes are good player but time has come to an end ,especially for scholes.(He is good to play against wolves and arsenal at old old trafford).if we want the title and C.L we need to give 40 M for real madrid player Diara and Tiote.. Both are far more better player than anyone else within the team in terms of biting the opponent like a dog.we lost tonight cause our midfield was nonexist.
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August 21st, 2012 at 1:37 am
“Securing the signature of Robin Van Persie proves a number of things to the footballing world. Firstly, it sends a message to the rest of the country that there is still sense in football. Money isn’t the be all and end all to every player”.
Is this the same RVP who we’ve just made the joint highest-paid player in English football (alongside another one of our players, Rooney, on £220k a week?!?)
Even if he’s only on, say, £200k a week, and that’s the MINIMUM he’ll be on, that’s over £65m all in, for a 29-year-old striker.
“MONEY”.
“SENSE”.
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NathonW Reply:
August 21st, 2012 at 11:47 am
Oh I am sorry, I did not realise you worked in the financial department at Manchester United.
Do you really think Man City couldn’t afford to offer him double what we did?
If it was about money, he would be wearing blue.
I admit he probably does earn well – but its plainly obvious that money was not the driving force in this transfer.
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August 21st, 2012 at 6:38 am
I will walk to South Africa to raise awareness we need a Defensive Midfielder. Watch the news and You tube.
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August 21st, 2012 at 8:03 am
i am that legendary player ur looking for ferguson
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October 5th, 2012 at 3:19 pm
I’m sorry, but the author of this article is extremeley biased, like most United fans. Please do us all a favour and shut up.
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NathonW Reply:
October 8th, 2012 at 1:00 pm
Biassed how, exactly? I can name many central midfielders who would get into our side, but none of them would entertain the idea of joining us.
Those who would come, aren’t good enough.
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October 8th, 2012 at 1:02 pm
The Tiote fan club are very quiet today.
Maybe he isn’t the answer to our problems – was he even on the pitch yesterday…….
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January 14th, 2013 at 2:49 pm
yes i do agree tiote is a great prospect for the future bt would much rather see sum1 who has a cool head take command of that CDM Position sum1 with the calibur of essien or cisse …who require sum1 who wont depend on opportunity but who will make things happen.A scholes OF 5-6 years back would have been ideel bt we still would`ve required a player with the ability to make , enticipate and orcestrate the tempo of the game both defencisively and offencinsively . my opinion is that going forward rvp provides that extra bit of flare that we required coz (give the man his due ) he has proven he is worth every RED DEVIL penny we have spent …bt with that being said that hole in the midfield that cristiano ronaldo left with his departure has really hurt us big time , bt ja enough about that lets give our boys a chance u never know they might just surprise us…ANY1 SENSE A TROPHY TREBLE FOR 2012/2013 ?
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